DHCP & Slim Dicovery protocol

[Sean Adams]

BTW, would it work if the emulator set the device id to 2 (meaning
'emulator') in the 'h' and 'd' packets?

Tough call - on the one hand, it's not really an emulator if it
intentionally behaves differently than the real hardware. On the other
hand, there are some things that we might want the server to do
differently for the emulator client. I prefer your original idea of a
"true" emulator.

Sean


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[Jacob Potter]

True, but you should still have a way to configure it manually.
Otherwise you won't be able to use it over a WAN, or on a LAN with >1
SliMP3 server.

Good point. As soon as the server supports SlimDP, I'll add it to the
emulator; something like: "Enter server's IP address or just press enter
to use SlimDP".

BTW, would it work if the emulator set the device id to 2 (meaning
'emulator') in the 'h' and 'd' packets?

- Jacob
--
"Terminak #3 has bad keyboard. Pkease fix."

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[Sean Adams]

This is also good news for the emulator; the only thing it needs to know
is the server's IP address. With SlimDP the emulator won't need the
server's IP coded in, nor will it need to deal with DHCP.

True, but you should still have a way to configure it manually.
Otherwise you won't be able to use it over a WAN, or on a LAN with >1
SliMP3 server.

Sean


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[Jacob Potter]

I've been hacking away on this for the last few days and it's almost
ready. The SliMP3 can now optionally obtain it's IP address, mask, and
gateway using standard DHCP (not BOOTP). Although DHCP also provides a
means to get a server's IP, I decided not to go that route because it
would be hard/impossible to configure on most DHCP servers.

This is also good news for the emulator; the only thing it needs to know
is the server's IP address. With SlimDP the emulator won't need the
server's IP coded in, nor will it need to deal with DHCP.

- Jacob
--
"Terminak #3 has bad keyboard. Pkease fix."

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[Sean Adams]

What about the little music note that was there the last time I used my
SliMP3? (I've been having major system re-org problems for a few weeks now
and have been without SliMP3 tunes and server code) :(

We've always had access to the full character set from the server. This is
just a limitation for the strings that are stored in ROM, where we have to
conserve space. Since ROM words are 14-bit, I get twice the density by
packing two chars into one word.

I'll be changing it so we can use the full character set in the firmware.
Also the strings will be user replaceable, so we'll be able to load
different languages into the player.

Sean


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[dean blackketter]

That's sent down by the server. Sean's only worried about the code
in the player itself that contains strings for setup before it talks
to the server.

The characters we can put in strings are currently limited to
ASCII, because I'm packing two 7-bit characters into each 14-bit program
memory word, to conserve ROM space. I guess since we won't use the high
chacters very often, I could just add a token which says add 128 to the
next char in the string.

That sounds good. The right arrow and the cursor are the only funny
display elements I think we'll need.

What about the little music note that was there the last time I used my
SliMP3? (I've been having major system re-org problems for a few weeks now
and have been without SliMP3 tunes and server code) :(
--
Amos Hayes
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[dean blackketter]

SDP (according to the IETF) already stands for Session Description
Protocol, so maybe the slimp3 discovery protocol needs a new name.

I noticed that. I figured it would be hard to get the two confused, but
you're right it would be better to use something unique. It had to be
short, of course, so I could fit it on the screen.

I'll update the UI spec to include the setup for DHCP or Static IP
configuration and automatic or manual server discovery.

I'm using "> " at the beginning of the second line, as a clue that this is
what's currently selected. I know this is inconsistent with the server
interface, but it seemed like a good idea to have some indication that
it's not just instructions or something.

Hm... I suppose that couldn't hurt. I do like your use of brackets
for the areas that change with up/down. Let me put together a new
proposal and let's see how it works.

The characters we can put in strings are currently limited to
ASCII, because I'm packing two 7-bit characters into each 14-bit program
memory word, to conserve ROM space. I guess since we won't use the high
chacters very often, I could just add a token which says add 128 to the
next char in the string.

That sounds good. The right arrow and the cursor are the only funny
display elements I think we'll need.

There are now up to four things that need to happen, before we're
1: DHCP for our IP address
2: Slim Discovery protocol for the server's IP
3: ARP for the server's MAC (I guess we could also glean it from step 2)
4: Slim hello to "connect" to the server
We need to give some user feedback at each step. The problem is it all
normally goes so fast (<20ms) that the user won't have time to read it.

In that case, we only need user feedback if part of it fails.
Otherwise, it should just start up and display whatever the server
tells it to in response to the hello.

I guess I'll need something to only print the step we're on if we get
stuck. Otherwise this stuff would just flash by and the user is left
wondering what he missed. Actually now that I think about it, that's not
too hard...

Right on.

I can send the strings.asm tomorrow if you want to take a look.

That would be a help.

-dean

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[Sean Adams]

Out of curiosity, what happens if the server (or dhcpd) isn't up when you
initialize? Does it keep retrying? Will the screen stay on or will it turn
off after a period of time?

It'll continue to retry every 2 seconds, with a message on the screen
showing where it's stuck. The screen will go to sleep, but you can
still wake it up by pressing a button. There should probably be a limit
after which it gives up and goes back to the setup menu - haven't done
that yet.

BTW... got room for SlimDP instead of SDP?

Yep, that's probably a better name.


Sean


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[dean blackketter]

<!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<head><style type="text/css"><!--
blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { padding-top: 0 ; padding-bottom: 0 }
--></style><title>Re: [slimp3-dev] DHCP &amp; Slim Dicovery
protocol</title></head><body>
<div>That's sent down by the server.&nbsp; Sean's only worried about
the code in the player itself that contains strings for setup before
it talks to the server.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>On Thu, 22 Nov 2001, dean blackketter
wrote:<br>
<br>
&gt; &gt;The characters we can put in strings are currently limited
to<br>
&gt; &gt;ASCII, because I'm packing two 7-bit characters into each
14-bit program<br>
&gt; &gt;memory word, to conserve ROM space. I guess since we won't
use the high<br>
&gt; &gt;chacters very often, I could just add a token which says add
128 to the<br>
&gt; &gt;next char in the string.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; That sounds good.&nbsp; The right arrow and the cursor are the
only funny<br>
&gt; display elements I think we'll need.<br>
<br>
What about the little music note that was there the last time I used
my<br>
SliMP3? (I've been having major system re-org problems for a few weeks
now<br>
and have been without SliMP3 tunes and server code) :(<br>
<br>
--<br>
Amos Hayes<br>
ahayes-***@public.gmane.org<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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&nbsp;<br>
<br>
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http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ </blockquote>
<div><br></div>
</body>
</html>

[dean blackketter]

<!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<head><style type="text/css"><!--
blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { padding-top: 0 ; padding-bottom: 0 }
--></style><title>Re: [slimp3-dev] DHCP &amp; Slim Dicovery
protocol</title></head><body> <blockquote type="cite" cite>&gt; SDP (according to the IETF) already
stands for Session Description<br>
&gt; Protocol, so maybe the slimp3 discovery protocol needs a new
name.<br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I noticed that. I figured it would be
hard to get the two confused, but<br>
you're right it would be better to use something unique. It had to
be<br>
short, of course, so I could fit it on the screen.</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>I'll update the UI spec to include the setup for DHCP or Static
IP configuration and automatic or manual server discovery.</div> <div><br></div> <blockquote type="cite" cite>I'm using &quot;&gt; &quot; at the
beginning of the second line, as a clue that this is<br>
what's currently selected.&nbsp; I know this is inconsistent with the
server<br>
interface, but it seemed like a good idea to have some indication
that<br>
it's not just instructions or something.</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>Hm...&nbsp; I suppose that couldn't hurt.&nbsp; I do like your
use of brackets for the areas that change with up/down.&nbsp; Let me
put together a new proposal and let's see how it works.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>The characters we can put in strings are
currently limited to<br>
ASCII, because I'm packing two 7-bit characters into each 14-bit
program<br>
memory word, to conserve ROM space. I guess since we won't use the
high<br>
chacters very often, I could just add a token which says add 128 to
the<br>
next char in the string.</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>That sounds good.&nbsp; The right arrow and the cursor are the
only funny display elements I think we'll need.</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>There are now up to four things that need
to happen, before we're<br>
&quot;connected&quot;:<br>
<br>
1: DHCP for our IP address<br>
2: Slim Discovery protocol for the server's IP<br>
3: ARP for the server's MAC (I guess we could also glean it from step
2)<br>
4: Slim hello to &quot;connect&quot; to the server<br>
<br>
We need to give some user feedback at each step. The problem is it
all</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>normally goes so fast (&lt;20ms) that the
user won't have time to read it.</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>In that case, we only need user feedback if part of it fails.&nbsp;
Otherwise, it should just start up and display whatever the server
tells it to in response to the hello.</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I guess I'll need something to only print
the step we're on if we get<br>
stuck.&nbsp; Otherwise this stuff would just flash by and the user is
left<br>
wondering what he missed. Actually now that I think about it, that's
not<br>
too hard...</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>Right on.</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br></blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I can send the strings.asm tomorrow if
you want to take a look.</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>That would be a help.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>-dean</div>
</body>
</html>

[Amos Hayes]

"Completely automatic (DHCP+SDP)"
If you choose automatic, it skips all the IP settings, asks for
confirmation, and you're done. If you choose either of the manual
options, it works basically the same as before from that point on.

Out of curiosity, what happens if the server (or dhcpd) isn't up when you
initialize? Does it keep retrying? Will the screen stay on or will it turn
off after a period of time?

The changes sound super. I can't wait to give it a shot. :)

BTW... got room for SlimDP instead of SDP?

--
Amos Hayes
ahayes-***@public.gmane.org


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[Sean Adams]

SDP (according to the IETF) already stands for Session Description
Protocol, so maybe the slimp3 discovery protocol needs a new name.

I noticed that. I figured it would be hard to get the two confused, but
you're right it would be better to use something unique. It had to be
short, of course, so I could fit it on the screen.

Are you planning on implementing the UI model I sent to you before?
If so, I could update it to include the DHCP/SDP stuff.

Yes, in terms of making more sensible use of the cursor keys - it's
almost exactly what you proposed, with the addition of the couple of menus
that I described.

A few other things, UI-wise:

I'm using "> " at the beginning of the second line, as a clue that this is
what's currently selected. I know this is inconsistent with the server
interface, but it seemed like a good idea to have some indication that
it's not just instructions or something.

The characters we can put in strings are currently limited to
ASCII, because I'm packing two 7-bit characters into each 14-bit program
memory word, to conserve ROM space. I guess since we won't use the high
chacters very often, I could just add a token which says add 128 to the
next char in the string.

There are now up to four things that need to happen, before we're
"connected":

1: DHCP for our IP address
2: Slim Discovery protocol for the server's IP
3: ARP for the server's MAC (I guess we could also glean it from step 2)
4: Slim hello to "connect" to the server

We need to give some user feedback at each step. The problem is it all
normally goes so fast (<20ms) that the user won't have time to read it.
I guess I'll need something to only print the step we're on if we get
stuck. Otherwise this stuff would just flash by and the user is left
wondering what he missed. Actually now that I think about it, that's not
too hard...

I can send the strings.asm tomorrow if you want to take a look.

Sean

-dean

I've been hacking away on this for the last few days and it's almost
ready. The SliMP3 can now optionally obtain it's IP address, mask, and
gateway using standard DHCP (not BOOTP). Although DHCP also provides a
means to get a server's IP, I decided not to go that route because it
would be hard/impossible to configure on most DHCP servers.
Instead there's a second, optional stage: Slim Discovery Protocol. SDP
sends a UDP broadcast to find any Slim servers on the LAN. The first
server to reply (unicast) is the one the SliMP3 uses. This means the
SliMP3 will now work out of the box with zero configuration on any LAN
with a DHCP server.
Comments/questions/suggestions would be welcome before I wrap this
up for beta testing. You'll need a Unix machine to install the firmware
update - sorry, the bootloader will be working on Windows soon.
Splash screen (4 seconds) " www.slimdevices.com \n Welcome to SliMP3"
"Would you like to set up the player?"
UP/DOWN/RIGHT chooses between "Yes - go to setup" and "No proceed
with startup"
"Please choose a configuration method"
UP/DOWN/RIGHT selects
"Completely automatic (DHCP+SDP)"
"Specify server manually (DHCP only)"
"Specify everything manually (static IPs)"
If you choose automatic, it skips all the IP settings, asks for
confirmation, and you're done. If you choose either of the manual
options, it works basically the same as before from that point on.
Also I fixed a number of little bugs including
- ARP timeout too long
- sleep timeout too short
- (h)ello packet. Used by servers to see if a SliMP3 is there, and used by
SliMP3s to announce themselves to the server at startup. This is so you
don't have to press a button to make the display come up when you first
plug in the player.
More user docs and protocol docs are in the works. Firmware update v1.1
will be ready in a couple of days.
Sean
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[dean blackketter]

This sounds great, Sean.

SDP (according to the IETF) already stands for Session Description
Protocol, so maybe the slimp3 discovery protocol needs a new name.

Are you planning on implementing the UI model I sent to you before?
If so, I could update it to include the DHCP/SDP stuff.

-dean

I've been hacking away on this for the last few days and it's almost
ready. The SliMP3 can now optionally obtain it's IP address, mask, and
gateway using standard DHCP (not BOOTP). Although DHCP also provides a
means to get a server's IP, I decided not to go that route because it
would be hard/impossible to configure on most DHCP servers.
Instead there's a second, optional stage: Slim Discovery Protocol. SDP
sends a UDP broadcast to find any Slim servers on the LAN. The first
server to reply (unicast) is the one the SliMP3 uses. This means the
SliMP3 will now work out of the box with zero configuration on any LAN
with a DHCP server.
Comments/questions/suggestions would be welcome before I wrap this
up for beta testing. You'll need a Unix machine to install the firmware
update - sorry, the bootloader will be working on Windows soon.
Splash screen (4 seconds) " www.slimdevices.com \n Welcome to SliMP3"
"Would you like to set up the player?"
UP/DOWN/RIGHT chooses between "Yes - go to setup" and "No proceed
with startup"
"Please choose a configuration method"
UP/DOWN/RIGHT selects
"Completely automatic (DHCP+SDP)"
"Specify server manually (DHCP only)"
"Specify everything manually (static IPs)"
If you choose automatic, it skips all the IP settings, asks for
confirmation, and you're done. If you choose either of the manual
options, it works basically the same as before from that point on.
Also I fixed a number of little bugs including
- ARP timeout too long
- sleep timeout too short
- (h)ello packet. Used by servers to see if a SliMP3 is there, and used by
SliMP3s to announce themselves to the server at startup. This is so you
don't have to press a button to make the display come up when you first
plug in the player.
More user docs and protocol docs are in the works. Firmware update v1.1
will be ready in a couple of days.
Sean
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[Sean Adams]

I've been hacking away on this for the last few days and it's almost
ready. The SliMP3 can now optionally obtain it's IP address, mask, and
gateway using standard DHCP (not BOOTP). Although DHCP also provides a
means to get a server's IP, I decided not to go that route because it
would be hard/impossible to configure on most DHCP servers.

Instead there's a second, optional stage: Slim Discovery Protocol. SDP
sends a UDP broadcast to find any Slim servers on the LAN. The first
server to reply (unicast) is the one the SliMP3 uses. This means the
SliMP3 will now work out of the box with zero configuration on any LAN
with a DHCP server.

Comments/questions/suggestions would be welcome before I wrap this
up for beta testing. You'll need a Unix machine to install the firmware
update - sorry, the bootloader will be working on Windows soon.

Here's how the new startup menu looks:

Splash screen (4 seconds) " www.slimdevices.com \n Welcome to SliMP3"

"Would you like to set up the player?"
UP/DOWN/RIGHT chooses between "Yes - go to setup" and "No proceed with startup"

"Please choose a configuration method"

UP/DOWN/RIGHT selects

"Completely automatic (DHCP+SDP)"
"Specify server manually (DHCP only)"
"Specify everything manually (static IPs)"

If you choose automatic, it skips all the IP settings, asks for
confirmation, and you're done. If you choose either of the manual
options, it works basically the same as before from that point on.


Also I fixed a number of little bugs including

- ARP timeout too long
- sleep timeout too short

And one other new feature:

- (h)ello packet. Used by servers to see if a SliMP3 is there, and used by
SliMP3s to announce themselves to the server at startup. This is so you
don't have to press a button to make the display come up when you first
plug in the player.

More user docs and protocol docs are in the works. Firmware update v1.1
will be ready in a couple of days.


Sean


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[dean blackketter]

<!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<head><style type="text/css"><!--
blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { padding-top: 0 ; padding-bottom: 0 }
--></style><title>Re: [slimp3-dev] DHCP &amp; Slim Dicovery
protocol</title></head><body>
<div>This sounds great, Sean.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>SDP (according to the IETF) already stands for Session
Description Protocol, so maybe the slimp3 discovery protocol needs a
new name.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Are you planning on implementing the UI model I sent to you
before?&nbsp; If so, I could update it to include the DHCP/SDP
stuff.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>-dean</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I've been hacking away on this for the
last few days and it's almost<br>
ready.&nbsp; The SliMP3 can now optionally obtain it's IP address,
mask, and<br>
gateway using standard DHCP (not BOOTP).&nbsp; Although DHCP also
provides a<br>
means to get a server's IP, I decided not to go that route because
it<br>
would be hard/impossible to configure on most DHCP servers.<br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Instead there's a second, optional stage:
Slim Discovery Protocol.&nbsp; SDP<br>
sends a UDP broadcast to find any Slim servers on the LAN. The
first<br>
server to reply (unicast) is the one the SliMP3 uses. This means
the<br>
SliMP3 will now work out of the box with zero configuration on any
LAN<br>
with a DHCP server.</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
Comments/questions/suggestions would be welcome before I wrap this<br>
up for beta testing.&nbsp; You'll need a Unix machine to install the
firmware<br>
update - sorry, the bootloader will be working on Windows soon.<br>
<br>
Here's how the new startup menu looks:<br>
<br>
Splash screen (4 seconds) &quot;&nbsp; www.slimdevices.com
\n&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Welcome to SliMP3&quot;<br>
<br>
&quot;Would you like to set up the player?&quot;<br>
UP/DOWN/RIGHT chooses between &quot;Yes - go to setup&quot; and
&quot;No proceed with startup&quot;<br>
<br>
&quot;Please choose a configuration method&quot;<br>
<br>
UP/DOWN/RIGHT selects<br>
<br>
&nbsp;&nbsp; &quot;Completely automatic (DHCP+SDP)&quot;<br>
&nbsp;&nbsp; &quot;Specify server manually (DHCP only)&quot;<br>
&nbsp;&nbsp; &quot;Specify everything manually (static
IPs)&quot;</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
If you choose automatic, it skips all the IP settings, asks for<br>
confirmation, and you're done. If you choose either of the manual<br>
options, it works basically the same as before from that point on.<br>
<br>
<br>
Also I fixed a number of little bugs including<br>
<br>
- ARP timeout too long<br>
- sleep timeout too short<br>
<br>
And one other new feature:<br>
<br>
- (h)ello packet. Used by servers to see if a SliMP3 is there, and
used by<br>
SliMP3s to announce themselves to the server at startup. This is so
you<br>
don't have to press a button to make the display come up when you
first<br>
plug in the player.<br>
<br>
More user docs and protocol docs are in the works. Firmware update
v1.1<br>
will be ready in a couple of days.<br>
<br>
<br>
Sean<br>
<br>
<br>
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